How to serve on a third sector board | Susan Boster in conversation with David Chun

David has led Equilar since its inception to become one of the most trusted names in the corporate governance community. David has been recognised as one of the “100 Most Influential Players in Corporate Governance” by the National Association of Corporate Directors (NACD), the Disruptor Award by 2020 Women on Boards and Outstanding 50 Asian Americans in Business. David speaks publicly on corporate governance and board diversity matters, including events hosted by The Conference Board, Deloitte, EY, HR Policy Association, KPMG, NACD, NASDAQ, NYSE, The Society for Corporate Governance and Stanford’s Directors’ College.

David serves on the boards of the Commonwealth Club of California, PGA Reach, the Silicon Valley Leadership Group (SVLG) and is a trustee of Committee for Economic Development (CED). He is on Nasdaq’s Center for Board Excellence Advisory Board, Catalyst’s Women on Board Advisory Council, the Women on Boards Advisory Council of the California Partners Project and the Advisory Council of the Angel Island Immigration Station Foundation. David is a member of Young Presidents’ Organization (YPO), Past Chair of the SF Bay Chapter, a founding member of the Council of Korean Americans (CKA) and former board member of the Wharton Center for Entrepreneurship and the Asian Pacific Fund Community Foundation of San Francisco.

What boards, private and third sector, do you currently sit on, and which have you sat on in the past?

The boards that I'm on today are the Silicon Valley Community Foundation, Silicon Valley Leadership Group, the Commonwealth Club World Affairs of California, and last but not least, PGA of America, which is a lot of fun.

One board that I'm not on, but where I'm very active, is TAAF (The Asian American Foundation). I'm working with the CEO of that group, Norman Chen, on how to increase the representation of Asian Americans on corporate boards.

Reflecting on your time serving on non-profit boards, what key insights or lessons have you gained that you've successfully applied to your roles on for-profit boards?

The Silicon Valley Community Foundation is overseeing about $15 billion, and it's an extensive operation. Even though it's a non-profit, it's a highly visible operation because of major prominent individuals who are involved; I've learned quite a bit from that. The name is Silicon Valley Community Foundation, but there are folks that recognise it nationally as being the country’s largest community foundation. So, the level of governance, the level of cybersecurity preparedness, audit scrutiny, etc. is extensive – if I printed out the 990, it’s a phone book. 

Other than that, it's all about the people. It's all about relationships - that has a disproportionate impact on getting things done.

Are there specific practices from for-profit governance that you feel should be more widely adopted across non-profit boards, or vice versa?

I look at problems through the lens of data, and I think that's a challenge. There's often an asymmetry with data, and certain sides have more data than others, which creates either an advantage or a disadvantage. So, I’m always thinking through from a governance perspective, ‘How do you level the playing field? How do you bring transparency? How do you make it easy to digest?’ It's not a volume issue. It's, ‘How do you present it properly? And how do you get to the key nuggets that really matter?’

Especially in this AI world, you can have the best models and algorithms and whatnot - but garbage in, garbage out. People are waking up to that, and many people aren’t prepared.

How do you see the evolving landscape around securing diverse talent for corporate boards in light of recent political and economic shifts? What are you advising your network in terms of best practice? 

I want [the world] to be about meritocracy. I'm all for affirmative action, but it needs to be income-based, not race-based. There's a disproportionate level of attention on black and brown... And everybody just assumes the Asians are fine. Often, when they often say, ‘People of colour’, it's black and brown, but not yellow. I don’t want us to be forgotten.

We track the trends, and we've identified that the black community (tragically, because of George Floyd), has made significant progress. The Hispanic community, frankly, has been left behind. Especially in the state of California, where 35-40% of the population is Hispanic, Hispanic people take up 2% of board seats. That’s a huge disconnect.

In comparison, depending on how you look at it, you could say that the Asian American community is doing well – or that we've got work left to do. In my mind, until we have one Asian person on every board, we have work to do. 

Equilar has been very involved in the whole diversity discussion, because we track the data, and if this is what the world wants to talk about, we're happy to provide the statistics. We want to make sure that AAPI candidates are at least given a shot, that we have a chance to present them. The more shots on goal, the more chances we’ll score. 

So, I'm helping out with that. There’s getting people trained and ready, and the other side of it is using our data. 

At the end of the day, there's great talent out there. I want to help get them in front of decision-makers. Best practice is just getting to know the right people and figuring out how you can help them.

What common criteria do you consider most important when considering potential board members for both non-profit and for-profit organisations?

Engagement. It's just the passion, the desire to want to help - whether that's on a for-profit board or non-profit board. As opposed to, “Hey, we're doing you a favour by us joining your board,” its, “Hey, the mission resonates with me, and I want to be involved.” I also look for good strategic thinkers who are asking good questions - classic Wayne Gretzky: skate to where the puck is going, not where it is right now.

What trends do you foresee in board governance and leadership over the next decade?

There’s been a lot of attention on succession planning. That's the board's number one responsibility - who's sitting in the CEO seat? I think a lot of businesses underestimate the importance of that, but we are starting to get interest from clients around succession planning.

When have you gotten it wrong, and what did you learn?

Everything often takes longer than what you plan for. I may want to move fast, but there are so many things that I need to be patient with. There's a marination process that needs to happen. So much of this is timing and alignment and positioning. Partnerships can be powerful, but aligning interests and timing is critical. You can announce a partnership, but if you don't have the right pieces in place, it falls apart.

Finally, what advice would you give to someone who is joining their first board, regardless of the sector, based on your wealth of experience across various organisations?

Try to meet with as many of the board members one-on-one outside the board meeting as possible; go for a coffee, for a tea, for a meal… Get to know them outside of the board room.

Also, ‘you have two ears and one mouth’ – early on, you're there to listen. (Thank you Herman Bulls!)  You're able to contribute, too, but some people try so hard to make sure they sound impressive right off the bat. That's not necessarily the expectation. The ratio of listening to speaking will increase over time, but early on, you’re there to be a sponge. The reality is, there's what's shared with you during the recruiting process, and then what’s shared when you walk in and realise [that the organisation is] out of money. So listen first, then speak.

Equilar is co-hosting with Nasdaq its Compensation Committee Forum on November 4th at the Harvard Club in New York City.  Link here with more details.

Susan Boster (interviewer) is the Founder and CEO of Boster Group Ltd., an award-winning consultancy specialising in the development of innovative partnerships between global corporations, cultural institutions and social impact foundations. Current and recent clients include Disney, Meta, Gap Inc., Moët Hennessy, J.P. Morgan, Bacardi, EY, Goldman Sachs, Montblanc and the Leverhulme Trust.

Previously, as Marketing Director at Barnes & Noble and later CMO at News International, Susan oversaw the transitions of both companies to e-commerce and digital platforms, including the launch of barnesandnoble.com.

 Susan sits on the board of the Design Museum and is an Advisor to The Representation Project. She previously served as a Trustee at the Donmar Warehouse and as Vice Chair of the English National Ballet. Susan is regularly featured as a moderator and keynote speaker at conferences such as the World Economic Forum, the Cannes Festival of Creativity and CogX, where she is an Editorial Advisor. She is a Consultant Lecturer at Sotheby’s Institute of Art.